Torture in the US

[Huggie Smiles]

I know! I was shocked too:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7229169.stm

[rbuffetta]

Re: Torture in the US

Beats making a video and cutting someones head off. Well that is a bad comparison. Nobody want to hear it but they have to use some form of torture to get the info out.

[thesightless]

Re: Torture in the US

the high and mighty always fall, we are falling because we are so high and mighty.

[Jenks]

Re: Torture in the US

tbh, i have no problem that this particular guy got tortured. granted, not what i want our country to be doing, but i would have had a hard time not just shooting that guy in the face when i captured him. i'd say that guy was a piece of crap, but that's not fair to the crap.

[Shpira]

Re: Torture in the US

I think this not surprising at all...and to be honest I think its naive to think that the CIA doesn't torture people...of course they do and will continue to do so as will all similar governmental organizations in other countries...
I honestly think its a pretty stupid thing to report in the news.

What do people think that they are gonna treat the suspect terrorist and madman nice and give them candy hoping that they will like them and tell them where the next attack is gonna happen...???
Honestly what do people imagine the CIA does?

[Jenks]

Re: Torture in the US

^we agree. stop the presses. lol. )

CIA, KGB (now FSB), and the Mossad- HELLO!!!! THEY TORTURE PEOPLE!!! It's just how shit works. Don't report it. This isn't news.

[nick007]

Re: Torture in the US

Lets not forget the beat cops on the street, police and military from all countries all over the world and the secret organisations with acronyms.

They all do it!!! and will continue doing it as long as there are people out there that kill, steal and destroy what fairytale democracy we think we are living in.

Lets face it, its the stupid ones that get caught and have to tell the world.

I laugh at the fact that they only did it to three people - What absolute rubbish!

We need not look for sadistic psychopaths on our streets because they are all over the place in government organisations all over the world.

[toasty]

Re: Torture in the US

The problem is this -- many people who are OK with torture feel this way because there is an assumption that the person who is being tortured is already guilty and had the information at issue. We see shows like 24, where you've got known terrorists who taunt their captors and say things like, "Yeah, I know where the bomb is, it's going to kill thousands of your people, but I'm not telling you where it is."

Let me just say that if we've captured someone who actually professes to have information we can use to save lives and he simply refuses to give it up, I don't think there are many people that would seriously argue with getting that information by any means necessary. The problem, however, is that that isn't how it plays out in the real world.

Imagine you're sitting in a chair having your fingernails ripped out and the only way to make it stop is to provide information -- information you don't have. That's a pretty troubling scenario. Your options at that point are to let it continue or make something up to at least have the pain stop for a little while, until they figure out that you've lied.

Different situations call for different reactions -- but torture being the modus operandi of the United States? You get captured by the US, you can expect to get your ass waterboarded? That's not what we're all about.

[thesightless]

Re: Torture in the US

same morals jimbo, different ethical approaches to reaching the moral goals

they arent doing it for fun, but in an attempt to save some lives that, that guy is obviously willing to take. some people would just lock em in a room and let them pray, workout, whatever, people like would start taking thier skin, starting at thier hands working towards to torso.

[toasty]

Re: Torture in the US

some people would just lock em in a room and let them pray, workout, whatever, people like would start taking thier skin, starting at thier hands working towards to torso.

Well, framing it like this is part of the problem. People seem to suggest that the only two options are torture and coddling them. There is a spectrum of things that you can do to a person to persuade them to provide information, and what I'm saying is that barring the hypothetical scenario I've discussed above, crossing the line from "harsh interrogation and persuasion" to "torture," both of which are on the same end of the spectrum, isn't justified.

"Harsh interrogation" as permitted under the Geneva conventions can be really, really harsh. What exactly is the point of taking it past that point? Eventually, it becomes either sadistic or punitive.

[Huggie Smiles]

Re: Torture in the US

theres gonna be some torture tonight!!

http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/02/07/hamza.uk/index.html

[Huggie Smiles]

Re: Torture in the US

Dubya veto'd

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/03/08/bush.torture.ap/index.html

[Miroslav]

Re: Torture in the US

I'm just not sure how we draw the line between "really harsh interrogation" and "torture".

[thesightless]

Re: Torture in the US

its too vague, and we cant define it.

we should just do what they do over there.

or the US citizens should just begin to advocate "american, pro western terror" i wouldnt mind seeing a few mosques in certain areas get bombed, and god knows i wanted to see mecca get nukes during haaj after 9-11. my feelings have changed since but i did indeed want to see it.

[88Mariner]

Re: Torture in the US

waterboarding? what' the big fucking deal?

some people treat that shit as a fetish ffs.

(of course, i'm with the majority who say that torture produces no viable information so it shoul be stopped)