Carl Craig is a fucking ...

[Kinetic]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

THIS.

The computer cannot select and EQ, thats left to whomever is at the helm.

end of fuckin discussion for me

And THIS.

Guys back in the day didn´t even want people LOOKING at them. Some DJ´s preferred to let the music do the talking and not even be visible in the booth.

It´s the music, man.

To me, it´s like having a car with an auto gearshift, if you don´t know when to accelerate or break, and if you can´t do kerbs decently, you probably won´t get to your destination too well. You´ll get to the end but will be a shitty ride and every passenger will leave not wanting to get aboard your car ever again.

Computers won´t automatically get you to know the metrics of the tracks, they won´t teach you how to EQ, and more importantly, won´t tell you how to sequence and program your set, and how to read a dancefloor.

You can be the greatest beatmatcher in history, but if you don´t know these basics, you still suck in my book.

[simonr]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

I thought Lawler was back and then found out we were actually listening to Pole folder for most of the supposed Lawler set.

Mr Folder's very under-rated.

Interesting thread guys ... it'll be interesting to see if there's a descernable difference when JD and Hernan transfer over ... I suspect there will be. These guys have always built sets based on the music and tracks, once they start layering and doing live "cheeky" re-edits a little bit of the old magic is lost ... if the new magic is better then great.

Will we get another timeless Yellow, Beirut Forum, Bedrock B-day, Fabric or Matter set ? Hernan's EM last year was fantastic ... was that done on laptop ?

When Sasha moved to CDJ's he'd play two tracks and twist and bend them into each other .. it could be pretty magical, as it needed 100% concentration, causing him to get lost in the music more ... and when he gets lost in that little musical world of his no-one could rival him. His ableton sets don't have that same vibe ... although he does get to spark up more ciggies in between.

To be fair S & D have been rather good when playing together off different formats (at Southfest'05 they took a year of average productions and turned them into a fantastic set) .. wonder what an all laptop S & D set would sound like : sonic NE layers and soundscapes ... or clicky drab short edits ?

The diverse opinions are what's great on this board ... just try not to turn on each other too much ffs !

[DIDI]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

I definitely don't under rate Polefolder . I think he is great But he doesn't get the attention he deserves!

Btw. I wouldn't be surprised if Hernan did the Em on a computer. He would have wanted it to be as perfect as possible and he didn't have an audience to respond to. Absolutely nothing beats his sets in a real club though !!

Interestingly the only time I saw Digweed crowd responsive was with Sasha.

[simonr]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

I definitely don't under rate Polefolder . I think he is great But he doesn't get the attention he deserves!

I'd never accuse you of under-rating anyone Didi, esp not PF

[minimal]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

I went to a chemical brothers concert last year, they had the actual studio racks on the stage. It was crazy. You could see the red and green LED lights turn on and off as they improvised at each song. It was magical

[Haziel]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

Mr Folder's very under-rated.

Interesting thread guys ... it'll be interesting to see if there's a descernable difference when JD and Hernan transfer over ... I suspect there will be. These guys have always built sets based on the music and tracks, once they start layering and doing live "cheeky" re-edits a little bit of the old magic is lost ... if the new magic is better then great.

Will we get another timeless Yellow, Beirut Forum, Bedrock B-day, Fabric or Matter set ? Hernan's EM last year was fantastic ... was that done on laptop ?

!

I'm almost 100% sure Hernan's radio show was done on ableton. the last 2 years of it. so he pretty much has done it for a bit

I dont think his EM was done on a laptop , but he sure did a lot of edits for that set.

When diggers makes that transition the 1st year of it it may sound a bit weird because he is new to it , but after that I'm sure he will ace it

[ganjamo]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

Kind of funny to see so many of you getting all butt hurt about mixing on laptops.

I thought this was more progressive oriented board?

Give Traktor a go with a great mixer and you might change your mind. It is so nice to be able to have 4 tracks flawlessly going at the same time, looping bits and pieces, doing awesome effects, maybe even playing a synth on the side. Makes for such a fun & unique experience.

It may sound like anyone can mix 2 tracks just like digweed or any other dj but they just WONT. Mixing isnt only about beatmatching...

Richie Hawtin for example is taking the current technologies to improve his sounds by using more than 4channels on a sets, and that takes a lot of skill. Not anyone achieve a smooth mix with all this stuff going on.

Technology is here to make our lives simpler and to help DJs have a better performance.

[feather]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

THIS.

all the best DJ's I like now, are using vinyl+laptop.
All the top techno dj's/jetsetters from berlin..

i love flawless mixing, and this let you focus on EQing and layering one track until the end, on time with the basslines.

use auto-cue,autobeat,mark your tracks like hawtin I DONT CARE! A beat lined up..is a beat lined up, it cant get better by ear/or by computer..

The computer cannot select and EQ, thats left to whomever is at the helm.

end of fuckin discussion for me

This was what I meant about software folks forgoing beat matching. Because the software takes beat matching out of the question, a lot of the software folks now conveniently assume beat matching is inconsequential, any DJ should know it, it's really the programing and EQing that makes the difference.

It´s the music, man.

To me, it´s like having a car with an auto gearshift, if you don´t know when to accelerate or break, and if you can´t do kerbs decently, you probably won´t get to your destination too well. You´ll get to the end but will be a shitty ride and every passenger will leave not wanting to get aboard your car ever again.

True, but let's see you drive a manual car. Beat matching, programing, the whole works, is what sets DJs apart. It is not fair to all the DJs out there, for another DJ to come along and choose what criteria suits him, what he feels he can be best judged upon.

When someone comes along and say, DJing is all about programming and EQing, and any person can beath match, that someone is doing a huge disservice to a lot of DJs out there; whether it's your bedroom DJ or the likes of Digweed.

Mixing isnt only about beatmatching...

Not anyone achieve a smooth mix with all this stuff going on.

Exactly. Let's see any software DJ try tweaking, editing, adding efx, and keeping a long mix going on two decks. That was my original point all along. If Carl Craig was doing it all a pair of decks, it would've blown my mind. In fact it did blow my mind listening to his mixing. But honestly once you realise he had a machine keeping those tracks together throughout those transitions while he worried about entry or cue points, it takes a little of the magic out of it.

You guys seriously tell me, if you heard what sounds like the perfect mix to you, you will not be blown away thinking this guy is up there doing it with his pair of hands, fingers trailing the side of the decks occasionaly to keep everything in time,deft touches to the EQ, while somewhere at the back of his mind he is planning his next 5 tracks, at the same time he is looping a sample or tapping on some efx?

As opposed to some guy who has his tracks cued up, and he's pressing buttons for efx and loops, and planning his next 5 tracks? Do you guys think it all happens in the head?

DJing is not some cerebral chin stroking exercise that is disassociated from the body or your motor skills. There is a craft involved in this. The same kind craft that might be reflected by someone who works with wood or painting or any form of art. Anyone can hack a block of stone, let's see you do a Rodin.

[DIDI]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

^^^ Too good !!!

I can see the hands!

[Life on Other Planets AKA Johns]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

I am back. what did i miss .. hmm this thread seems interesting

[Haziel]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

TO Feather

You seem to be saying basically the same thing just with other words ... I understand that you love the human factor involved in all of this, the nudges , the syncopation of the beats ,etc... then you probably appreciate more clothe that are hand made , lamps carved out of wood and so on...

I saw Danny Howells 2 week ago he used vinyls and cds and i thought it was beautiful... but mate for a time it will be good and then... when the progression of EDM goes further ... it won't do it for nobody to have a dj only mix 2 cds.

When people start wanting more, something different to listen to ??? what is going to happen? It would be a terrible thing for us the "vanguardist" in music ( and i'm incluiding all dj's and producers of edm) to just remain out of all the advances that technology is bringing to the world.

I take pride to be part of a scene that clearly influences all other music genres in the rest of the world because of the sound , the way to perform music , and last but not least T E C H N O L O G Y .

I rejoice myself in the fact that software is bringing the performance of a dj closer to perfection , that the dj is finally doing what he always wanted to... what he dreamed of... what he always pictured in his mind that some day it would happen, but that he wasnt capable of doing it because... he only had 2 hands.

[simonr]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

TO Feather

You seem to be saying basically the same thing just with other words ... I understand that you love the human factor involved in all of this, the nudges , the syncopation of the beats ,etc... then you probably appreciate more clothe that are hand made , lamps carved out of wood and so on...

I saw Danny Howells 2 week ago he used vinyls and cds and i thought it was beautiful... but mate for a time it will be good and then... when the progression of EDM goes further ... it won't do it for nobody to have a dj only mix 2 cds.

When people start wanting more, something different to listen to ??? what is going to happen? It would be a terrible thing for us the "vanguardist" in music ( and i'm incluiding all dj's and producers of edm) to just remain out of all the advances that technology is bringing to the world.

I take pride to be part of a scene that clearly influences all other music genres in the rest of the world because of the sound , the way to perform music , and last but not least T E C H N O L O G Y .

I rejoice myself in the fact that software is bringing the performance of a dj closer to perfection , that the dj is finally doing what he always wanted to... what he dreamed of... what he always pictured in his mind that some day it would happen, but that he wasnt capable of doing it because... he only had 2 hands.

We could also be getting nearer to the point where robots are cheaper to book then dj's.

[kassios]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

^^ What if the robot crashes lol

[DjNutcase]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

You have to decide what is more important to you - The Music or the Way the Music is Made.

Simple choice.

If you are interested in the Music, any advances in music production will of course be welcomed.

It's just a simple fact - A skill that was needed for doing amazing DJing has been rendered irrelevant by technology. Are we to forever hide in the past, away from new technological advances while calling ourselves PROGRESSIVE ?

TO FEATHER: In 20 years - with producers being able to make totally new and mind-blowing music, will you STILL be complaining that the DJ is not timing their tracks manually, like they did with vinyl in the 1980s?

'Cause that would be hysterical!!

[coleby761]

Re: Carl Craig is a fucking ...

I can see both sides of the debate here and it's good to hear different opinions. However in the end just give me something to make me move and I'll be happy.