When Torture Is Appropriate

[Dzone]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

torture is never appropriate.

200%

[bobjuice]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

Torture is never appropriate.

I agree 100% - but we could make exceptions for certain people (George Bush and Tony Bliar spring to mind)

[Kamal]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

Torture is never appropriate.

cant believe this would be the first time we disagree. I'm not "for" torture in the sense of hurting another human, but if you see where this human is coming from in terms of what he has done to deserve what is being dished to him, hell yes I am for it. Be it mild-torture (head dunking in water) or gruesome torture (plucking nails with pliers).

karma doesn't see neutral ground, you get what you've given. the severity of the crime should balance how you get thrashed.

And this isn't only for the terrorist elements, child-rapists stand higher up the torture chain for me. those guys need a slow and painful life till they die naturally.

[chunky]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

Its seems to me these people in the article claim to of masterminded the attacks but they failed to go into details of their roles in the plot. Its sounds to me like they are claiming to something they didn't do. Normally when someone comes forward and claims to of committed a crime the can get into specifics. So you want to torture them for mouthing off`?

Personally I dont think anyone will ever be convicted over 9/11. Because in order to have a trial you have to have the evidence and 8 years later we are still waiting. All I've ever herd is speculation and nonsense

[Huggie Smiles]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

Be it mild-torture (head dunking in water) or gruesome torture (plucking nails with pliers).

karma doesn't see neutral ground, you get what you've given. the severity of the crime should balance how you get thrashed.
.

how does your karma treat the person who does the torturing? they are scot free as its government sanctioned?
I am curious to hear your views on this?

[Kamal]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

how does your karma treat the person who does the torturing? they are scot free as its government sanctioned?
I am curious to hear your views on this?

even God kicked satan's ass, you saying he should've stayed passive through the ordeal because of karma? someone's gotta do the ass kicking of the wrong...... right?

as for "government sanctioned", u really asking me that Q? I dont know of any government in the world that will legally authorize this. People in charge are told to do what "needs to be, to get the job done". Go ahead spend the billions that you need to in legal cases and court costs when 1 week with a good spank will get you the answers you need.

[Huggie Smiles]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

even God kicked satan's ass, you saying he should've stayed passive through the ordeal because of karma? someone's gotta do the ass kicking of the wrong...... right?

as for "government sanctioned", u really asking me that Q? I dont know of any government in the world that will legally authorize this. People in charge are told to do what "needs to be, to get the job done". Go ahead spend the billions that you need to in legal cases and court costs when 1 week with a good spank will get you the answers you need.

you brought up karma not me!!

but you are advocating - in your view - pedophiles and terrorists should be tortured due to the severity of their crime - right?
"hell yes I am for it. Be it mild-torture (head dunking in water) or gruesome torture (plucking nails with pliers)."

[Kamal]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

you brought up karma not me!!

but you are advocating - in your view - pedophiles and terrorists should be tortured due to the severity of their crime - right?
"hell yes I am for it. Be it mild-torture (head dunking in water) or gruesome torture (plucking nails with pliers)."

what has karma got to do with governments letting "prison beatings/tortures" slip-by? call me mate, we're having a disconnect of epic proportions.

As for being an "advocate"... no, if I was ever in the position to, I would never personally pass a law enforcing torture, there is a greater part of me that is non-violent. if my comments appeared to seem as though I'd be one dishing it out with passion had I been given the chance, then that wasn't what I intended to portray by a long shot.

all I'm trying to say is that I'm not against people facing the blunt end of the law by those who are in a position and are willing to dish it out and I for one am not against the treatment meted out to the guilty.

it's kinda like being stuck in the place of being against animal cruelty, yet willing to dine on a medium-well filet mignon.

[DIDI]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

Afraid I disagree really strongly on this one!! It would actually be a bit freaky if we agreed on absolutely everything !!

You can't get away from the fact that who ever is doing the torturing is doing a very bad thing!! Torture is a lose, lose situation. !!!

Btw If the animal has had a good life and killed quickly and cleanly there ain't nothing wrong with a good fillet mignon. However medium-well is a crime against the beast and consumer !!

[Kamal]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

Afraid I disagree really strongly on this one!! It would actually be a bit freaky if we agreed on absolutely everything !!

You can't get away from the fact that who ever is doing the torturing is doing a very bad thing!! Torture is a lose, lose situation. !!!

Btw If the animal has had a good life and killed quickly and cleanly there ain't nothing wrong with a good fillet mignon. However medium-well is a crime against the beast and consumer !!

well we wouldn't wanna freak you out now would we..... perhaps I should've said it as, I have almost always agreed with the sentiment in all of your argument and this is probably the first time I think differently.

As for medium-well being a crime against the "beast", there is a saying in my language that says (and this is a lose translation cause I the literal one would've been a line worthy of standup) "The Devils of war cannot be convinced by art of conversation".

Like I said before, we'll just agree to disagree

[lilsensa]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

Remember being a kid, and your older brother would hold you down and drop spit almost down to your face and then suck it up?

You would pretty much do anything to make him stop.

With torture on a grand scale, such as water boarding, lack of sleep, cold conditions, and being made to stand for hours on end, you would say or do anything to make it stop.

That being said, the validity of statements from these prisoners after being tortured, could be next to nothing.

Torture makes people talk, but it does not mean that they are telling the truth. They just want the torture to stop.

[toasty]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

Torture makes people talk, but it does not mean that they are telling the truth. They just want the torture to stop.

Along these lines:

The Gambian government rounded up about a thousand people in a massive witch hunt last week. Literally. They really believed these people were witches and presented an existential threat to the Gambia.

They made many of the accused drink potions to get them to confess to being witches. They then dunked a lot of them in that same "dirty water." Finally, they tortured them to within an inch of their life. And lo and behold, they confessed. It turns out there are witches in Gambia!

At least, Dick Cheney must think so, because torture works, right? Or is it possible that people will say absolutely anything to get you to stop torturing them, including admitting to being a witch?

The President of Gambia was rumored to have said, "Fighting witches is a tough, mean, dirty, nasty business. These are evil people. And we're not going to win this fight by turning the other cheek."

So, I would like to ask all conservatives, neoconservatives and Republicans who defended the Bush-Cheney regime of torture: If torture works, are those people in Gambia really witches?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/cenk-uygur/dick-cheney-believes-ther_b_177891.html

[Huggie Smiles]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

Cheney is a witch fo sho - !

[Kamal]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

That is mindless torture, which I too am dead against that. If you round up a bunch of suspects with your head in the sand and just because you are looking to blame someone due to lack of your own abilities in trying to resolve a case, then you get into a mindless witch hunt as above.

Torture of the accused, especially those who have confessed to a crime before any harm was done to them, is mainly what I am referring to. They get what's due to them in their own right and remember this in return, for when they potentially reform and are out on the streets.

[Miroslav]

Re: When Torture Is Appropriate

Torture of the accused, especially those who have confessed to a crime before any harm was done to them, is mainly what I am referring to. They get what's due to them in their own right and remember this in return, for when they potentially reform and are out on the streets.

But you get no information from them. We're now talking about torture for revenge / "moral correction" vs. torture for the sake of extracting valuable information that might save lives. The former is what they do in the Middle East when they do stuff like hack off your hand for stealing (not a great idea, in my opinion); the latter is the kind that I thought might be the case as it related to America. And as far as the logic there goes, I agree with lisensa: you torture someone enough, and they will tell you whatever you want to hear in order to make the pain stop.