Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

[gokada]

It offers a rebuttal, and deservedly so, to Fahrenheit 9/11....one of the most influential parts of Fahrenhype 9/11 is when the families of dead soldiers that were featured in Fahrenheit 9/11, and others also featured, speak out against Moore's distortions of the facts and his methods of their own exploitation. Keep an open mind, do additional research before hasty conclusions are met...

[sacredawe78]

Re: Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

It offers a rebuttal, and deservedly so, to Fahrenheit 9/11....one of the most influential parts of Fahrenhype 9/11 is when the families of dead soldiers that were featured in Fahrenheit 9/11, and others also featured, speak out against Moore's distortions of the facts and his methods of their own exploitation. Keep an open mind, do additional research before hasty conclusions are met...

moore's had empirically verifiable data - video of gw, video of the death and destruction in iraq, families in mourning, much more, etc.

you could actually see and hear the shit unedited...it was indisuptable

the only thing you can dispute is the "overall" message and how those scenes were structured to convey the message..even then you'd have to ignore the cold hard reality of it to even do so

i looked at the back of hype 9/11 at blockbuster and saw nothing but pictures of politicians talking...if all they have to offer is a bunch of brainwashed idiots justifying the war, sounds like garbage to me...that includes brainwashed people trying to justify why their son or daugther is there in the first place

please tell me there is more too it than that...

[thesightless]

Re: Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

scared go see this movie and try to realize that micheal moore is a scumbag trying to make a buck b/c he can use political views with his great skill to make a movie.

if this fat fuck would do things in a more positive manner, focusing about change, instead of trashing the past he could have a much greater effect.

farenhype is a great film , as was moore's, also i would recommend the other rebuttal film celciusXX(forget the nuumber). moore only gives his empirical data that he acn use for his benifit. he tends to leave out the other side. he also makes great use of cut and paste editing(go look at hestons speech in bowling where heston has about 4 outfits on but moore says its one speech). also he only uses selected quotes from people, rather than thier whole words.

the guy is a scumbag. plain and simple, he does not public service in his actions. all he does is stir up shit that should be left alone.

[sacredawe78]

Re: Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

scared go see this movie and try to realize that micheal moore is a scumbag trying to make a buck b/c he can use political views with his great skill to make a movie.

if this fat fuck would do things in a more positive manner, focusing about change, instead of trashing the past he could have a much greater effect.

farenhype is a great film , as was moore's, also i would recommend the other rebuttal film celciusXX(forget the nuumber). moore only gives his empirical data that he acn use for his benifit. he tends to leave out the other side. he also makes great use of cut and paste editing(go look at hestons speech in bowling where heston has about 4 outfits on but moore says its one speech). also he only uses selected quotes from people, rather than thier whole words.

the guy is a scumbag. plain and simple, he does not public service in his actions. all he does is stir up shit that should be left alone.

i don't think he stirs up shit that should be left alone...guns are a problem, so is the war in iraq...it got people thinking...which is something that desperately needs to happen...so i don't think he is as bad as you say he is....which i do not understand at all...i just do no undertand your reasoning...what is your reasoning anyway??? all films use editing, cut and paste, etc....it was a very powerful film...i have yet to see much evidence to refute it...if all you have to say is that heston wore different outfits, then that is pretty weak...the message was clear...and if it wasn't something people could understand or relate to in there everyday lives then it would't have been so popular...what do you think they do on cnn?? america gobbles that up like crazy..but there is a lot of editing there...i don't see your point in that respect

[cosmo]

Re: Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

i don't think he stirs up shit that should be left alone...guns are a problem, so is the war in iraq...it got people thinking...which is something that desperately needs to happen...so i don't think he is as bad as you say he is....which i do not understand at all...i just do no undertand your reasoning...what is your reasoning anyway??? all films use editing, cut and paste, etc....it was a very powerful film...i have yet to see much evidence to refute it...if all you have to say is that heston wore different outfits, then that is pretty weak...the message was clear...and if it wasn't something people could understand or relate to in there everyday lives then it would't have been so popular...what do you think they do on cnn?? america gobbles that up like crazy..but there is a lot of editing there...i don't see your point in that respect

Are you really sticking up for MM?

What a joke.

[thesightless]

Re: Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

all films use editing, cut and paste, etc....it was a very powerful film...i have yet to see much evidence to refute it...if all you have to say is that heston wore different outfits, then that is pretty weak...the message was clear...and if it wasn't something people could understand or relate to in there everyday lives then it would't have been so popular...what do you think they do on cnn?? america gobbles that up like crazy..but there is a lot of editing there...i don't see your point in that respect

well, if you actually wanna be informed from people who arent fanatcis of his views, then go check out those 2 movies.
every thing he says is rebuked in the same manner he attacks. all based in ""empirical data"", just the data he left out.


second, he uses cut a paste to create, rather than edit. are you seriously taking a message that incorporates different sentences from 4 speeches that are shuffeld around to sound like something else? thats comparable to this::

i HATE the fact that ALL MUSLIMS are being pigeon holed --real quote

to-

I HATE ALL MUSLIMS--- moores movie quote

also, half the people he has interviewed go back later on and claim that they were misquoted. something fishy there. go back to bowling and realize that there was a waiting period when he bought the gun(he was in the bank for about 3 hours the first day, noted on thier security cameras,,, and then had to go back after his gun liscence was verified, yeah he left that out, but came out in the banks lawsuit.) and the fact that he paid an undisclosed amount to the bank teller whom he made look like a moron.

i call these moore facts b/c they seemed to have been left out of his movie.

[sacredawe78]

Re: Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

all films use editing, cut and paste, etc....it was a very powerful film...i have yet to see much evidence to refute it...if all you have to say is that heston wore different outfits, then that is pretty weak...the message was clear...and if it wasn't something people could understand or relate to in there everyday lives then it would't have been so popular...what do you think they do on cnn?? america gobbles that up like crazy..but there is a lot of editing there...i don't see your point in that respect

well, if you actually wanna be informed from people who arent fanatcis of his views, then go check out those 2 movies.
every thing he says is rebuked in the same manner he attacks. all based in ""empirical data"", just the data he left out.


second, he uses cut a paste to create, rather than edit. are you seriously taking a message that incorporates different sentences from 4 speeches that are shuffeld around to sound like something else? thats comparable to this::

i HATE the fact that ALL MUSLIMS are being pigeon holed --real quote

to-

I HATE ALL MUSLIMS--- moores movie quote

also, half the people he has interviewed go back later on and claim that they were misquoted. something fishy there. go back to bowling and realize that there was a waiting period when he bought the gun(he was in the bank for about 3 hours the first day, noted on thier security cameras,,, and then had to go back after his gun liscence was verified, yeah he left that out, but came out in the banks lawsuit.) and the fact that he paid an undisclosed amount to the bank teller whom he made look like a moron.

i call these moore facts b/c they seemed to have been left out of his movie.

where can i find more of this information...i will watch those movies, if i can bear anyone upholding conservative America...i will bear it so i can understand more of what you say

i liked moore's message because i felt that way before i saw it and i still do

what about george bush's quotes?? you cant deny they guy is a complete jackass...it didnt look like too much editing there to me

why didn't george bush go in front of the 9/11 commission?? does he think he is above the truth, what is there to hide

was that family in the film a lie?? i saw her supporting michael moore after the movie came out

what about the marine who quit?? i think he supported him after the movie as well

and the scenes from michigan with the army recruiters...i mean most of us went through that in high school...so its not bs

as far as bush's relation with the saudis and the bin ladens...there is so much there, regardless if some of it is over-exaggerated (which i am supposing is true) you cant deny how compelling it is

so what if it took michael moore three hours to get a gun rather than 30 minutes...who give a fuck...what kind of bullshit is that

did you ever stop and think that the conservative resources you may have used to uncover some of these things did some editing or tampering as well

even if things were chopped up to make a more powerful picture...i think it is good...people don't really understand what they are saying half the time, the implications involved...michael moore had to show things in a plain fashion

i will bear the burden of watching a conservative American argument...just so i can understand where you could possible be coming from...but i can tell you is that if all you have to say is a couple little things like that to refute things, they can't be all that great

[sacredawe78]

just went to michaelmoore.com and there is a whole section of articulation on there to allow naysayers such as yourself sources for his material...check it out

[LobsterClan]

*Snicker* The Moore bashers paragon of "truth", 'Bowling for Truth' has an entire section devoted to the Iraq-Al Qaeda connection, and even lists it as NEW material. Please note that there was absolutely no connection between Iraq and Al Qaeda, and Rumsfeld and Cheney have finally even admitted such: http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/fahre...raqalqaeda.htm

[LobsterClan]

An excellent review of "Fahrenhype 9/11" by the editor of the Chicago Sun Times: http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/.../41028002/1023

The guy clearly has no bias for Moore, as he freely bashes him on several occasions, but he sees the absolute idiocy, name-calling, and pathetic talking heads brought in on this movie.

[santo26]

Re: Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

Is not the film I would like to see, cause to brutal for me,and who knows what is the truth

[ian]

Re: Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

I haven't seen either of these films, but I've read plenty of reactions to both. It seems like films like are for those that refuse to think for themselves.

Those that hate George Bush love MM and his films because it gives them "proof" that he's a corrupt president, people who like GW hate MM and love films like Fahrenhype because they give "proof" that MM is a liar!

The truth is, these are political films - people in politics have an agenda and to back up their agenda they present "truths" in such a way that convinces people of their way of thinking! They are not lying, but they are presenting the part of the story that they are happy for the public to see. If MM's films were a pack of lies, there would be no need for controversy over them, no film company would have funded it, and if they had they'd have been sued for libel! MM presents the truth, but doesn't tell the whole story - Farenhype tells the other half of the story! Neither film will be lying, but they have an agenda to fulfill and they're only going to tell people what backs that up - I'm sure if you pushed him to it, there would be somethings GW had done that MM would agree with, at the same time, there will be other things GW has done that he sincerely regrets - but their not gonna tell the public about these things are they?!

Learn to think for yourselves and then the world won't need people like MM!

[thesightless]

Re: Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

where can i find more of this information...i will watch those movies, if i can bear anyone upholding conservative America...i will bear it so i can understand more of what you say

thats the thing, it took moore over a week to actually get the gun, they did an ID check that he seemed to leave out of his version of what happened.

its not about upholding conservative america. its more about using your common sense. unfortunaetly it is gonna take more deaths to make people realize there are thigns you need to be ultra conservative on and things that need to be liberal.. security needs to be handeled by the ost conservative people while social policy, outside of education, should be handeled by the more liberals. as well as foreign policy. i recall the instance where the guy refused to give up his ID to airport security b/c he felt "infringed upon".. well you know what, if it keeps us all safer and prevents what happened , i will gladly offer up my ID. i have nothing to hide.

and as far as making a more powerful picture i could create one as well, (obviously not like moore) but dont claim the president is corrupt b/c moore gives selective facts, look at them all. haliburton ties to cheney are there, but most people dont know that only about 3-4 firms in the world can handle the work they were offered, they gave a cheaper price and were one of 2 firms based in countries that assisted in the war. also, people cry about bush and the fact that saudi investors were involved in his firm. last time i looked, upper ranking employees are solely responsible to the shareholders and localalities. i guess doing your job in the past is reaosn for future criticism.

i mean look at how clinton let things get outta hand domestically while just sufficing things abroad.(education, taxes, financial reporting, etc) i think he was worse b/c he bombed from afar, while the currernt pres at least is going to attempt to bring about a change towards democracy and setting up infrastructure. i mean, i was serving in the army under clinton and i backed him fully, but some of the shit we did was shadier than letting a country know we were coming, and staying. go look at military OP's in yugoslavia and bosnia.

the only other thign i beleive we need to be conservative on is criminal prosecution for repeat violent offenders and mostly rapists and murderers. we should not have to pay upwards of 1k a day to keep these scum alive in jail when they do the most dispicable acts(rape being worse than murder IMO) to others, ruining the victims lives, ending the victims lives, but we will all foot the bill to keep them alive and in prison with 3 square, shelter, health care, and excercise. when it costs 16.50 for a 45 pack of .22 caliber bullets. they forgo thier rights to civility when they deny others of those rights, violently.

on the more liberal things.
stupid shit that repubs do that i have a vex over is things like generic perscriptions. go get em, if they have the same formula as the brand name, how are they different?

stem cell research. allow it, but dont let people sue for wrongful deaths when it goes wrong in testing, we need to see the viable options.

foreign policy, while im glad bush doesnt on behalf of the states, i damn glad they care about it. clinton did amazing things in that regard.(outside of his hit and run style attacks)

[sacredawe78]

Re: Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

where can i find more of this information...i will watch those movies, if i can bear anyone upholding conservative America...i will bear it so i can understand more of what you say

thats the thing, it took moore over a week to actually get the gun, they did an ID check that he seemed to leave out of his version of what happened.

its not about upholding conservative america. its more about using your common sense. unfortunaetly it is gonna take more deaths to make people realize there are thigns you need to be ultra conservative on and things that need to be liberal.. security needs to be handeled by the ost conservative people while social policy, outside of education, should be handeled by the more liberals. as well as foreign policy. i recall the instance where the guy refused to give up his ID to airport security b/c he felt "infringed upon".. well you know what, if it keeps us all safer and prevents what happened , i will gladly offer up my ID. i have nothing to hide.

and as far as making a more powerful picture i could create one as well, (obviously not like moore) but dont claim the president is corrupt b/c moore gives selective facts, look at them all. haliburton ties to cheney are there, but most people dont know that only about 3-4 firms in the world can handle the work they were offered, they gave a cheaper price and were one of 2 firms based in countries that assisted in the war. also, people cry about bush and the fact that saudi investors were involved in his firm. last time i looked, upper ranking employees are solely responsible to the shareholders and localalities. i guess doing your job in the past is reaosn for future criticism.

i mean look at how clinton let things get outta hand domestically while just sufficing things abroad.(education, taxes, financial reporting, etc) i think he was worse b/c he bombed from afar, while the currernt pres at least is going to attempt to bring about a change towards democracy and setting up infrastructure. i mean, i was serving in the army under clinton and i backed him fully, but some of the shit we did was shadier than letting a country know we were coming, and staying. go look at military OP's in yugoslavia and bosnia.

the only other thign i beleive we need to be conservative on is criminal prosecution for repeat violent offenders and mostly rapists and murderers. we should not have to pay upwards of 1k a day to keep these scum alive in jail when they do the most dispicable acts(rape being worse than murder IMO) to others, ruining the victims lives, ending the victims lives, but we will all foot the bill to keep them alive and in prison with 3 square, shelter, health care, and excercise. when it costs 16.50 for a 45 pack of .22 caliber bullets. they forgo thier rights to civility when they deny others of those rights, violently.

on the more liberal things.
stupid shit that repubs do that i have a vex over is things like generic perscriptions. go get em, if they have the same formula as the brand name, how are they different?

stem cell research. allow it, but dont let people sue for wrongful deaths when it goes wrong in testing, we need to see the viable options.

foreign policy, while im glad bush doesnt on behalf of the states, i damn glad they care about it. clinton did amazing things in that regard.(outside of his hit and run style attacks)

what do you have to say about all of the evidence that lobsterclan and i have just presented to uphold michael moore's films?

are you just going to continue to ignore it?

after all that is what we were discussing

[sacredawe78]

Re: Anyone see Fahrenhype 9/11?

I haven't seen either of these films, but I've read plenty of reactions to both. It seems like films like are for those that refuse to think for themselves.

Those that hate George Bush love MM and his films because it gives them "proof" that he's a corrupt president, people who like GW hate MM and love films like Fahrenhype because they give "proof" that MM is a liar!

The truth is, these are political films - people in politics have an agenda and to back up their agenda they present "truths" in such a way that convinces people of their way of thinking! They are not lying, but they are presenting the part of the story that they are happy for the public to see. If MM's films were a pack of lies, there would be no need for controversy over them, no film company would have funded it, and if they had they'd have been sued for libel! MM presents the truth, but doesn't tell the whole story - Farenhype tells the other half of the story! Neither film will be lying, but they have an agenda to fulfill and they're only going to tell people what backs that up - I'm sure if you pushed him to it, there would be somethings GW had done that MM would agree with, at the same time, there will be other things GW has done that he sincerely regrets - but their not gonna tell the public about these things are they?!

Learn to think for yourselves and then the world won't need people like MM!

im not a proponent for die hard subjectivism....that is way too typical

we need a moral agenda pal...that takes communication and a common goal...not a continual struggle with no goal, which is one excessively valuing subjectivism, relativism, individualism, capitalism, etc. leads to and has lead to in this culture a la the enlightenment