Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

[toasty]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

The one other thing I'll mention on the town hall front is that there is a difference between making sure your voice is heard, and making sure that no voices can be heard, and that no debate be had at all. Seems like the goal here is closer to the latter.

[runningman]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

Ya toasty and not to mention he only got positive media throughout the whole campaign. Never a negative thing about him. Hillary even pointed that out when Barack was going up against her she realized the establishment was behind him. His endorsements that Florida brought up as well is a leading indicator that it was absolutely not organic or grassroots.

[floridaorange]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

It's actually not that simple RM, the money contributed to campaigns comes in at different times. The way to judge the candidates by contributions or ties to the establishment is more based what happened before the campaign begun and the candidates back-story. Which is a big part of the reason why Obama did win and why he was the right candidate for the job, his ties to the establishment were far less entrenched than his opponents. Obama ran a very well planned and sophisticated campaign, large in part thanks to individuals such as Toasty who may not have normally gotten involved at the grassroots level in order to mobilize their town very early on in the process (btw).

Polls are being taken constantly and advertised by the media on local and national levels which then attracts the bigger institutional donors that are needed to win.

*edit - I meant mobilize not immobilize

[Miroslav]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

Statistics can always be manipulated, but at least this one recent poll of over 1,000 Americans suggests that the "generally consciousness" of American opposition to the health care reform is actually more like 50/50 split.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/08/05/health.care.poll/index.html

[floridaorange]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

^My overarching point was that townhalls rarely occur in such a fashion, and actually the number of people at them is greater than I would have expected to have seen, but that's just me.

[runningman]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

the real grassroots movement was Ron Paul. He raised a lot of money from american citizens.

[etincelles]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

....

[subterFUSE]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

the real grassroots movement was Ron Paul. He raised a lot of money from american citizens.

And he is completely through now because he called Bruno a queer on camera.
(not that he had much of a chance to begin with)

[runningman]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

what a crock of shit this is.. "Hurt our President..." Well dressed people could be terrorists now.

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZV84OBtGpSQ[/YOUTUBE]

[toasty]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

what a crock of shit this is.. "Hurt our President..." Well dressed people could be terrorists now.

To quote Zbigniew Brzezinski, "[y]ou know, you have such a stunningly superficial knowledge of what went on that it's almost embarrassing to listen to you." She's not referring to terrorist acts, she's referring to trying to hurt him politically -- and the well dressed people she's referencing are the participants in the so-called Brooks Brothers riots.

[superdave]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

I think calling the people at the town hall meetings right wing operatives and not real citizens is a lame excuse. Of course the people at the rallies are politically motivated. Most normal citizens are apathetic to political news. And btw, the Democrats are quite good at name calling and ridicule. Will they finally stop talking about Palin? Let it go Libs.

Bottom line is a lot of Americans don't like the health care plan because people don't understand it and it's expensive. And Obama with his boring press conferences can't even explain it well. He uses examples like "take the blue or red pill". I felt like I was watching the Matrix. Ok Morpheus, which pill costs us less in the end? Cost is the other thing that scares people. A trillion here on stimulus and another trillion for health care worries people and that's why people are mad as hell at these town halls.

[Miroslav]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

I think calling the people at the town hall meetings right wing operatives and not real citizens is a lame excuse.

And who said they weren't real citizens? I know sure didn't. All I said was that (1) these events were probably not as "spontaneous" as they would like you to believe, and (2) out-screaming people at town halls is probably not a very good approach to determining policy, regardless of your political persuasion.

[superdave]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

And who said they weren't real citizens? I know sure didn't. All I said was that (1) these events were probably not as "spontaneous" as they would like you to believe, and (2) out-screaming people at town halls is probably not a very good approach to determining policy, regardless of your political persuasion.

I meant the news is reporting these are strategically placed Republican operatives not you personally. Though it wouldn't surprise me if there was some planning by the right wingers. However, I would bet a large majority of the people are genuine citizens worried about the future of health care. And if this is the case, I could see a big backlash against Obama and his administration for demeaning them.

And as for the loud protesting, why can't they be loud? Some of the exchanges I saw were not as unruly as the media makes you think it was. I didn't see any shoes being thrown or Congressmen running for their safety. Dissent is supposed to be highest form of patriotism or did that change once a Democratic President was elected?

[Miroslav]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

^^ Well ok, I can't speak for the media, but as for me... again, no one is saying that there should be no dissent. Hey, we're all for dissent - but I personally would prefer it in the context of a dialogue. If people don't like the health care proposal and show up to debate why they believe it's a bad idea, then I think that's great. If they show up just to disrupt the possibility of any dialogue, then I don't think that's so "patriotic". I'm sure that's not what has happened / will happen in all forums of debate for health care and other issues, but it definitely seemed that way in most of the vids that have been circulating out there in the recent days.

[runningman]

Re: Town Halls Turn into Town Mess

^^Like when George Washington sat down with the British and talked it out..

I think you have a false representation of your country Miro.

Obama has a new email address you can email if someone is talking bad about his healthcare reform. flag@whitehouse.gov What a load of shit this is. You can send the comment in and tattle tale on your neighbours. What is this world coming to?

http://blogs.abcnews.com/thenote/2009/08/gop-senator-white-house-encroaching-on-first-amendment.html