you know what's astonishing?

[bobjuice]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

and wasnt that the same government that sent its troops to a trick war,

2 trick wars - just sayin

[yesme]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

Don't flatter yourself so much yesme. You haven't caused me to throw out any information as of yet my friend.

It slipped by you eh?

notice the bold part

what beliefs did you throw away after you saw they were not your own fact based beliefs?

notice there is nothing in there about any info i might have passed on.

let me put it in 3rd grade terms....."Have you ever looked at where your beliefs come from and why you hold them"?

[floridaorange]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

"Have you ever looked at where your beliefs come from and why you hold them"?

uh huh. have you?

[res0nat0r]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

5.52



Any one see a problem here

yeah, airport security sucked then, and still does. pretty pathetic.

[yesme]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

uh huh. have you?

ok, good, then anwser the question

what beliefs did you throw away after you saw they were not your own fact based beliefs?

[floridaorange]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

I appreciate your question, let me take a whack at this...Well I never understood the affects gender apartheid can have on young men until learning about the suicide bombers lives. Or that Egypt is where Al Qaeda was formed and Saudi Arabia was just given the label of hosting Al Qaeda. I never really understood how so many different circumstances such as religious extremism, gender apartheid, lack of acceptance of depression within a society combined can lead to the creation of terrorist camps equipped with individuals willing to commit suicide and kill many innocent lives.

[yesme]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

I appreciate your question, let me take a whack at this...Well I never understood the affects gender apartheid can have on young men until learning about the suicide bombers lives. Or that Egypt is where Al Qaeda was formed and Saudi Arabia was just given the label of hosting Al Qaeda. I never really understood how so many different circumstances such as religious extremism, gender apartheid, lack of acceptance of depression within a society combined can lead to the creation of terrorist camps equipped with individuals willing to commit suicide and kill many innocent lives.

While that was interesting, it was not a belief you had that you discarded after examanation and finding it false.

[floridaorange]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

^Then I wasn't being clear. My belief was that these men were not too different from me, or maybe even guys I grew up with... but after having gotten to know them a little bit better, I recognized patters that indicate that they were raised very different from not only me, but different from most young men in the world.

[Shpira]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

I think he means something ground braking...such as that you will not be a top athlete with super model wife and a billion in the bank...or the whole society we live in is geared towards creating retarded idiots that will buy shit they don't need going into debt and becoming dependable slaves of the system they will not question out of fear for their employment...
Or maybe I don't understand?

[floridaorange]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

I also recently learned that shopping is all there is to do in many parts of the middle east, sounds super fucking boring if you ask me.

[yesme]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

^Then I wasn't being clear. My belief was that these men were not too different from me

great, now where did this belief come from? did you grow up over there or did you just imagine that they must not be too different from you?

but after having gotten to know them a little bit better

meaning you spent time with them over there or over here correct? or did you get to know them better thru the mainstream media?

I recognized patters that indicate that they were raised very different from not only me, but different from most young men in the world.

Interesting, what paterns exactly did you recognize? and how do you know how most young men in the world are raised? Is this an assumption on your part or do you really know how most young people are raised?

I think he means something ground braking...such as that you will not be a top athlete with super model wife and a billion in the bank...or the whole society we live in is geared towards creating retarded idiots that will buy shit they don't need going into debt and becoming dependable slaves of the system they will not question out of fear for their employment...
Or maybe I don't understand?

i meant any and all beliefs, is it not somehow high and mighty of ourself to believe ANY ideal we have is original? i mean there is 6 billion people on the planet, and god knows how many before the current crop thats on this rock now.

Only when we can understand that most our beliefs are not only passed down to us, but they are also wrong for a number of reasons. In order to rid yourself of these blinders(cause we see everything thru our belief glasses), you have to sit down, identifiy all your beliefs and then search yourself for why you believe these things, when you started believing them, and if they still hold true or not.

It's a very well stated fact that people with preconceived notions about a subject will not listen to any different info on the subject if it goes against their beliefs, no matter if the new info is fact or not.

According to cognitive dissonance theory, there is a tendency for individuals to seek consistency among their cognitions (i.e., beliefs, opinions).

Dissonance theory applies to all situations involving attitude formation and change. It is especially relevant to decision-making and problem-solving.

http://tip.psychology.org/festinge.html

[res0nat0r]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

From all that Dr. Phil stuff above it sounds to me like you are trying to get others to validate what you what you believe is true, rather than the other way around.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, he is not entitled to his own facts."
- Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan of New York

[yesme]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

From all that Dr. Phil stuff above it sounds to me like you are trying to get others to validate what you what you believe is true, rather than the other way around.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, he is not entitled to his own facts."
- Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan of New York

Interesting that is what you took away from that post, i guess we cant all be intelligent i suppose.


and now for some more interesting 9-11 news....

Pentagon Attempts to Block Book Exposing Afghan War Secrets

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/09/09/military-intelligence-attempts-block-book-afghan-war/

On the eve of Sept. 11, Fox News has learned the U.S. Defense Intelligence Agency has attempted to block a book about the tipping point in Afghanistan and a controversial pre-9/11 data mining project called "Able Danger."

In a letter obtained by Fox News, the DIA says national security could be breached if "Operation Dark Heart" is published in its current form. The agency also attempted to block key portions of the book that claim "Able Danger" successfully identified Mohammed Atta as a threat to the U.S. before the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks

Specifically, the DIA wanted references to a meeting between Lieutenant Colonel Tony Shaffer, the book's author, and the executive director of the 9/11 Commission, Philip Zelikow, removed. In that meeting, which took place in Afghanistan, Shaffer alleges the commission was told about "Able Danger" and the identification of Atta before the attacks. No mention was made in the final 9/11 report.

In a highly unusual move, the DIA is now negotiating with the publisher, St. Martin's Press, to buy all 10,000 copies of the first printing of the book to keep it off shelves -- even after the U.S. Army had cleared the book for release.

Shaffer spoke to Fox News before he was asked by the military not to discuss the book. He confirmed efforts to block the book and other details.

The documents and exclusive interviews, including an Army data collector on the Able Danger Project, are part of an ongoing investigation by the documentary unit "Fox News Reporting" which uncovered new details about American cleric Anwar al-Awlaki and efforts by the FBI to track and recruit him for intelligence purposes after 9/11.

~~

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Able_Danger

~~

In December 2006, a sixteen-month investigation by the US Senate Intelligence Committee concluded "Able Danger did not identify Mohamed Atta or any other 9/11 hijacker at any time prior to September 11, 2001," and dismissed other assertions that have fueled 9/11 conspiracy theories.

The Senate Judiciary Committee first attempted to investigate the matter for the Senate in September, 2005. The Pentagon "ordered five key witnesses not to testify", according to Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Arlen Specter. "That looks to me as if it may be obstruction of the committee's activities," Specter, R-Pennsylvania, said at the start of his committee's hearing into the unit. [1]

[res0nat0r]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

The government trying to hide its incompetence when the cat is already out of the bag? Thats not news, thats SOP. Also I thought foxnews was the enemy.

[yesme]

Re: you know what's astonishing?

The government trying to hide its incompetence when the cat is already out of the bag? Thats not news, thats SOP. Also I thought foxnews was the enemy.

there are many sources for this story, this is just the first one i came across.

also i think you missed this part...

In

a

highly

unusual

move,




the DIA is now negotiating with the publisher, St. Martin's Press, to buy all 10,000 copies of the first printing of the book to keep it off shelves -- even after the U.S. Army had cleared the book for release.