bolivia socializes thier oil....................

[thesightless]

yeah, woo hoo, lets fuck over the companies who bought the land.....

if i were BP or total, i would take the 6 month window to disassemble every single peice of machinery and ship it to where they can still operate freely, not under a ""do as i say, not as i do"" socialist leader.

but shit, if it lowers gas prices, do it everywhere. my desire to see a free economy and the need to drive around conflict.

[KinKyJ]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

Socialist? I heard he was a populist...

So, any high altitude bombers on their way to restore our fine neo liberal system?

[Yao]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

Protectionism for 15-20 yrs under a development-orientated regime, then a transitional period of 5-12 yrs towards the free market.

It's a way to to it.

[thesightless]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

good , im kinda happy the spanish government and spanish and brazil companies have came out today saying they are leaning to pulling out their resources from bolivia and no longer investing in the country. best news in regards to economic policy in ages. morales just pushed a little too much. he was planning on taking 82% of revenues and now it is gonna bite him in the ass when he loses a monster source of income from the companies

[KinKyJ]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

^^^ Hear hear!

True. Morales excuse was that he wanted control over the energy supply of the country. Nice excuse to steal from others that have invested in the country, created employment AND pay taxes.

I can't believe this actually possible today.

[thesightless]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

socialism is the complete opposite idea of how i view a positive economy. its too limited in scope to the independent business owner. with all due respect to nederlands, who the fuck is the government to tell me how much i can make and limit me if i want to work harder all the while allowing somone who works half as much to earn equal. like unions only worse, unions can be controlled, governments cannot.

[Yao]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

Lemme tell you something else then: this fine capitals system of ours is one that keeps extracting resources from South America and Africa (not denying their own faults here, just concentrating on the deficiencies in that beloved capitalist system of yours and playing devil's advocate), thereby hampering any serious development.

Where the fuck do you think the REAL money goes man, into Bolivia? Hell no, the concessions bought there are peanuts in comparison the the profits that oil companies make on the Western market. Those companies also work in close harmony with the elites in Bolivia, who are all too happy accepting that money and selling out their country to secure their positions. Everyone is getting pissed off at Morales because if he nationalized oil, he'd take the control over that resource out of the hands of Western transnationals and the country's elite, the ones that are profiting off it right now. An open market can only flourish if it's competitive, and the South-American market laregely is NOT, especially that of Venezuela and Bolivia. By trying to nationalize oil, it would become (1) a resource that can be redistributed by the govt and (2) a resource whose profits can be redistributed by the state.

The stories of Africa and South America are virtually the same in this sense, and in both case the West that is boasting it's democratic system profits of the deep division between upper class and the middle and lower class and the patron-client system which it officially despises so much to secure it's interests. All you have to do is a litle studying up on the money flows to see this, guys....

Europe and America are NOT about real development. They are about creating an environment that is favourable to their politics and their economic expansion. What bugs me so much is that the predatory behaviour among politicians and elites in Africa and South-America are facilitating this so well.

[Yao]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

I'm SO going to back this up with a nice article later on, which i'm readin for my exam tomorrow...it says everything I said, only better (that guy finished his studies )

[thesightless]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

1. lets face it, outside of """"NATURAL BEAUTY""", africa has nothing to offer a leading nation or company as a reason to invest, there are zero incentives there other than a sense of guilt. and obviously that isnt enough when we let aparthide last for as long as it did, guys like mugabe run around and basically let half the population destroy the other half.... harsh reality it is.

2. yao, i am fed up with your militant evil views. please stop of i am referring you to your government. j.k. and you forgot to add point 3 to ur 3rd paragraph. (((3.a resource that will no longer be viable to extract for a few years once the companies who got fucked take thier expertise and equipment back to europe and brazil.)))

and the big problem with capitalism in third world nations isnt capitalists, its the governemnts of said countries. like with immigration here, we are bitching aobut the mexicans and salvadoreans being here, while we should be looking at why they come here like they do. 1. mexican government, 2. mexican government, 3, the repsective societies where drug lords have more pull than officials,

and there should be a division of the classes....IF you want it, earn it. people who are lazy, uneducated etcetc dont deserve to be wealthy.

[KinKyJ]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

Yeap, it's like fucking Miss Universe contestants: everybody wants that, but unless you're the chairman of the jury, you're stuck playing with your wiener...

What's wrong with you Yao, or should I say Mao? You a commie fag son?

Oh btw, I did my share of charity today: I had a piece of sandwich left over from lunch and I Fedex'ed it to Etheopia.

[Yao]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

I'll get back on this once i'm capable of formulating a coherent answer again, since i'm utterly pissed off with blowing my exam today due to the fact that the goddamn degenerate piece of shit cunt professor that made it had me read 3 full books about the philisophical problems development studies is currently facing when trying to assert globalization and in the end asks me specifically about little lists of terms that are hidden somewhere in the stockpile of articles I've read for today.

F**KING BITCH


And it wasn't just me....more than half the class fucked this one up big time. Pissed people all over the place - "did she want us to understand the bigger picture or simply likes posing questions the way they do on primary school?"

Really...she went around telling us she wants us to develop our academic skills...then neglects to reflect that in the way she questions us during an exam. This was by far the worst exam in 7 years, subpar stuff. I read a whole goddamn book on Values in economics, backed up with an Arestotelian framework (basically telling us that even neo-liberal economies are NOT essentially rationalist, but constantly influenced and constituted by values of which the prime 3 are Freedom, Justice and Care), and she goes around asking for the - literally- single paragraph about the position of women in economics under the influence of globalization and how i can relate this to another article, thus bypassing the message of the book completely and in every single fucking way.

God i need to kill someone right now. This means my trip to Africa will be cut short by at least a week to begin with, THANKYOUVERYMUCH VAN ZANTEN!!!

[thesightless]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

well thats what you get for studying a feild that has zero factual basis outside of dead people's opinions on what they disliked in others. and how they were right in the end. you know, just like every philosopher from decartes to hefner, they all had the only solution..... philosophy and sociology... the only majors to leave you with no job skills for helping the real world but a unhealthy viewopint on how to fix it.. go figure.

[Yao]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

Dude, i'm learning about development policies (which incorporate economics and their theories) and political distortions in Africa, now how does that not qualify as valuable for a career in international politics and development? Really, if it's a joke then sorry for my reaction, but it'd better since otherwise that is one of the most retarded things I've ever heard about my studies mate.

And btw...i'm still completely worked up, don't expect too nuanced answers right now...

[thesightless]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

if you really wanted to help you would learn to act as an agent, get a group of companies together, fund a public works prodject to get a fucking highway built, or a canal so equiequi over there can get a glass of water that doesnt have a dead lions blood init. then you could have a company go in there, hire people and try to create a financial basis to build on rather than asking the west to ""forgive debts"" that were incurred the last time somone had an idea to fix africa. get a trade skill that they need, not another opinion based on someone else's opinion that failed before. obvioiusly the capitalism model works, look around at the coutries that use it or a modified version of it to fit government. USA, england, japan, china...see a trend there>? lets take a peek at how to tackle this one.... 1. just forcefuly remove the african leadership. 2, take a decade building infrastructure and planting the seeds of business. 3. after 8 years begin funding a public vote where anyone can run for government and let it be unrestricted.

none of this.....waaah they were raped economically.....cry baby shit. if they wanted to survive they would do it themselves. they are helpless and sadly, only the stronge survive. rule of earth since the ameoba.

[KinKyJ]

Re: bolivia socializes thier oil....................

Why do we want to get Africa on the same level as we are anyway? Another continent sucking our oil reserves dry? Fucking up the Kyoto norm even more? Damnit, it's already bad enough that the Chinese are stealing employment from us as it is.

And apart from that, where are we going to sell our obsolete weapons and dump our chemical waste when Africa gets civilised?

God, it's been decades since we've brought civilisation and christianity to the bush, we've taught them how to dig up raw materials and plant banana's, we've built roads, ports airstrips to export it all to civilisation. Then the fuckers thaught they could do better and demanded independence. We gave it to them and what do they have to show for 50 years later? Nada, nothing, niente.

Columbus and the Conquistadores burned, looted, raped and killed throughout the Americas. Now do you hear the Latino's bitchin'? No, they got their shit together and started planting poppys and coca.

It's all Darwin to me. Like Sean said: survival of the fittest.