Lost in Atlantic

[bobjuice]

Re: Lost in Atlantic

I read yesterday that the terrain under the water is comparable in scale to the Andes which is pretty mind boggling. Just impossible terrain. Forgive a dumb question but aren't the black boxes designed to float? If not, why not?

[Kamal]

Re: Lost in Atlantic

I read yesterday that the terrain under the water is comparable in scale to the Andes which is pretty mind boggling. Just impossible terrain. Forgive a dumb question but aren't the black boxes designed to float? If not, why not?

That's a very good question and it peaked my curiosity enough to google for answers when I ran into 2 very good comments on another message board

I imagine it's rather difficult to make a device that's heavily tied in to the aircraft's systems suddenly break off, jettison out in a way that won't be trapped by the plane, and float on its own when it detects an accident has occurred, but only after it's sure that no more pertinent information can be recorded.

Design emphasis is on surviving impact. Adding a flotation device isn't really practical.

[bobjuice]

Re: Lost in Atlantic

^ Yeah it was a dumb question really as the "black box" is a figment of our imagination which in reality is a small part of the whole comms and control system, not something you can pick up and walk off with. Technology could easily produce something else that is a separate entity though, and have the "brain" of the plane send it messages (wireless) - maybe not monitoring absolutely everything but logging the important events? Make it buoyant and design it to come away from the plane (relatively) easily.

[nick007]

Re: Lost in Atlantic

^some good points there bob!

[Kamal]

Re: Lost in Atlantic

The black box is actually a device you can walk away with. And the funniest of all, its actually orange in color.

The cockpit voice recorder from the downed Alaska Airlines Flight 261, held by the robotic arm of the remotely piloted vehicle that retrieved it

With any airplane crash, there are many unanswered questions as to what brought the plane down. Investigators turn to the airplane's flight data recorder (FDR) and cockpit voice recorder (CVR), also known as "black boxes," for answers.

[Garrick]

Re: Lost in Atlantic

http://www.nypost.com/seven/06042009/news/worldnews/jets_horrifying_final_14_minutes_172538.htm

pretty intense read... i can't imagine being on that flight.

[nick007]

Re: Lost in Atlantic

^Latest news is that the debris found is just sea trash and they still have no idea where the plane is wtf?

[Kinetic]

Re: Lost in Atlantic

I mean they found oil, debris, even a plane seat... if it΄s not from the Air France plane, what the fuck happened?

[bobjuice]

Re: Lost in Atlantic

Strange indeed - this is from associated press

Debris 'not from downed jet'

French forces have found no evidence of debris from an Airbus A330 airplane that vanished over the Atlantic with 228 people on board, France's transportation minister said today.


Dominique Bussereau urged "extreme prudence" about suspected debris fished from the ocean.
He said he regretted an announcement by Brazilian teams that they had recovered plane debris from Air France flight 447 turned out to be false.
He told RTL radio that the search will continue and stressed that the priority is finding the flight recorders.
Confusion broke out yesterday after the Brazilian Air Force said a helicopter plucked a cargo pallet from the sea that came from the plane, but then said six hours later that it was not from the Airbus.

[bobjuice]

Re: Lost in Atlantic

Missing plane was 'flying too slow' to avoid Atlantic storm

Messages said to show Airbus had depressurised and was diving into ocean
By John Lichfield in Paris




New evidence suggests that the doomed Air France Airbus was flying too slowly for safety just before it fell from the sky over the ocean late on Sunday night.
French investigators believe the aircraft adopted the "wrong speed" before it flew into a bank of 100mph storms in the south Atlantic between Brazil and Senegal, according to the newspaper Le Monde.
Four automatic, emergency messages transmitted by the Airbus A330-200 in the space of four minutes, published by Brazilian newspapers, suggest a catastrophic collapse of the aircraft's main and back-up electrical systems. The last message, transmitted at 11.14pm Brazilian time – "cabine en vitesse verticale" – suggests that the cabin depressurised and the aircraft fell apart in mid-air.
The French agency investigating the crash said last night that the messages were "incoherent" about the plane's speed. But aviation experts said the revelations threw some new light on the mystery of what happened to flight AF447 and its 228 passengers and crew. However, they pointed out that it was difficult to separate symptoms and causes. Was the aircraft flying slower than the recommended speed because it was already in difficulty? Could low speed alone have permitted a modern aircraft to be torn apart by a tropical storm?
Le Monde said yesterday that the Airbus company intended to issue a "recommendation" to all other users of the A330-200 that the engines must be maintained at "optimum power" in "difficult weather". However, both Airbus and the French air accident investigation agency said no such statement was imminent.
Earlier, Brazilian officials dismissed claims that the aircraft, flying from Rio de Janeiro to Paris, had exploded in midair. They said a large slick of aviation fuel found in the ocean close to other debris from the Airbus suggested that the aircraft may have fallen apart but it had not exploded in flames. French officials have said that they cannot rule out a terrorist attack but that this appears extremely unlikely.
As the French Foreign Minister, Bernard Kouchner, attended a Mass for the victims of the crash in Rio yesterday, ships from both countries were converging on the presumed crash site about 400 miles north-east of the Fernando de Noronha islands off Brazil's northern coast. Until the debris, and possibly the "black box" flight recorders, are examined, the fate of the aircraft is likely to remain a mystery. Brazil's Defence Minister, Nelson Jobim, said wreckage, ranging from a life jacket to a seven-metre-wide section of fuselage, was scattered over 140 miles of ocean.
A French naval ship carrying robot submarines, the Pourquoi Pas, is expected to reach the area late next week. The submarines will attempt to locate and retrieve the aircraft's flight recorders.
Brazilian newspapers yesterday published details of the aircraft's final messages. The pilot sent a signal at 11pm Brazilian time, saying he was entering a zone of violent storm clouds. Ten minutes later, the aircraft sent an automatic message saying the auto-pilot had been switched off, followed in rapid succession by pre-programmed messages saying that the computerised navigation system had moved to alternative power and other key systems had failed.
At 11.14pm the Airbus sent the final automatic message – "cabin at vertical speed" – which suggested the jet had depressurised and was diving into the ocean or falling apart.
Patrick Smith, a US aviation analyst, told the Associated Press news agency the messages suggested the aircraft's electrical systems may have been crippled by lightning. "What jumps out at me is the reported failure of both the primary and standby instruments," he added. "From that point the plane basically becomes unflyable."